biting, nipping in an older puppy..help!

Question:
 Hi..Lucy the rescued Lab is doing great. Let's us know when she wants to go out, goes in her crate at night without fussing, loves to play catch, and a baby-gate in propped up in front of the counter has stopped the jumping up on the counter.
We've generally tried to praise her when she does what we want and just get her attention on to something else when she has done something we would rather she hadn't done.
We are home with her so she gets lots of "ball-time" during the day (soon we'll have a fence so she'll get more ball-time outside).
We got her from the humane society 3 weeks ago and I don't think she had any obedience training. She did the puppy nipping at first and we could stop it by giving her something else to chew on. But the biting and nipping has become frenzied. The more you try to stop her or get her interested in something else the more she bites/nips.
But she has no recognition of any type of "correction". She totally ignores a sharp "no", a scruff just seems to get her going more, a can/plastic bottle with rocks (loud noise) she just picks it up and runs like it's a toy. We've recently even tried a tap on the nose or butt. Nothing seems to stop her it just gets her going more. Today I tried ignoring her and she just followed me around nipping at my rear for while.
She also only does this to me. My husband gets more the play nipping around the cuffs and sleeves, but with me it gets serious. I'm the one who trains her, feeds her, provides treats, etc. I'm also the one that will take her to obediance school commencing next week.
Any suggestions on how to stop this 9 month old 50 pound "puppy" from nipping and biting?
:mad: It's getting frustrating.

Answer:
 What do you do when she gets even more frenzied?
Other than when I'm working with a new dog and aggression, when I give a 'correction,' the dog usually only comes back a few times. They learn rather quickly. :wink:

Answer:
 My baby girl is ten weeks old. I have now mastered the "Respect human flesh thing". When she bites too hard, I roll her lip against one of her sharp little teeth. This is just to remind her how her teeth can hurt. If you are too harsh with this method the puppy will only learn fear & hide. It is an art form, but if you can master it your puppy will learn the value of human flesh. The puppy must learn not to bite hard.

Answer:
 I wouldn't do the scruff thing, that is possibly what is making it worse, sometimes they view that as rough play so come back even rougher.
Have you tryed using a small spray bottle filled with just water? I used that on my golden and it was the only thing that worked for me, of course it means you have to carry around that spray bottle and keep it hidden in your back pocket, but it worked for me so maybe it will work for you.

Answer:
 When I try to correct her she comes back at me worse. Right now I'm trying "time outs" in her crate (which I hate doing 'cause I don't want her to associate it with punishment). The biting is beyond play...it's more like a contest so I'm assuming she is trying to become dominate (isn't going to happen my little girl :cool: ).
When she gets frenzied with the biting, I keep saying (and sadly, sometimes yelling) a sharp "no", remove her teeth from my arm and have tried everything from giving her a chew toy (she ignores it), sharply tapping her on the nose, to holding her snout with my fingernails gently pushing into it like a "bite" (that worked at first, but now she ignores that too). We've used the scruffing with other dogs with great success but you may be right in that she's see it as rough play and we have no idea if she spent enough time in the litter to have experienced a mother dogs reprimands.
This morning the biting seems to stop but she started seriously chewing on the couch and pillows (and ignoring reprimands on that too). But tonight after some ball time she started back at knawing/biting on me.
I'll try the spray thing, but I seriously think she'll ignore that. It's like her brain goes into haywire mode. We start obedience training Monday but this biting/nipping thing has to get under control quickly. :confused:

Answer:
 Time out in the crate is the best thing. She won't hate her crate because of it. You won't get so frustrated that you start repeating yourself. It will all work out in the end with a lot of patience. Remember, she probably ended up at the shelter because her first owners never corrected her, let it get out of hand, and had finally had enough.

Answer:
 I wouldn't do the scruff thing, that is possibly what is making it worse, sometimes they view that as rough play so come back even rougher.
Have you tryed using a small spray bottle filled with just water? I used that on my golden and it was the only thing that worked for me, of course it means you have to carry around that spray bottle and keep it hidden in your back pocket, but it worked for me so maybe it will work for you. I tried doing that and it does not work with labs (also, a trainer told me that is a no-no with labs).:2cents:

Answer:
 ...it's more like a contest so I'm assuming she is trying to become dominate (isn't going to happen my little girl :cool: ). This is the attitude you'll need to keep to be successful. :)
When she gets frenzied with the biting, I keep saying (and sadly, sometimes yelling) a sharp "no", remove her teeth from my arm and have tried everything from giving her a chew toy (she ignores it), sharply tapping her on the nose, to holding her snout with my fingernails gently pushing into it like a "bite" (that worked at first, but now she ignores that too). This is normal when she comes back harder. For a very determined pup, I'm also quite determined, but instead of saying 'no!' I simply make the consequence a little harder. I use the nails in the snout too and I can jab my fingers also. Just keep doing it. Act as if the pup doesn't exist when you do it. And you're also calm too. When you make the consequence harder than the pup's (or the dog's) desire to do something, it will stop. Generally what happens is folks think that they are going to hurt the dog. In some cases, yes, they do go too far, but when you're training, if you keep that proper balance, you will have success. Occasionally one has to step back and try something different.

Answer:
 Well, the water bottle is working for today with the biting. So far all of the correction methods work for about a day and then she starts ignoring them...but at least today we have existed in peace. Also got a bottle of Yuck and sprayed it on the corners and seams of the couch and that seems to be working....so far. The new antic today is the leash...she wants to hold it when we are coming back into the house from a walk...ok by me unless there is some problem with this I don't forsee.
Out of curiosity why did the trainer say spraying a lab with water was a NoNo? Seems pretty inconsequential to me so I'm curious why he/she felt it was a bad thing to do to a lab.

Answer:
 Sound slike we are hvaing the same sort of problem. Oscar is 7 months old and constantly bites. He actually has a few types of bites, a jerk bite, where he get all wound up, bites various body parts, and runs away, then come jolting back to bite, and runs away again. Just asking to be chased. He also bites ( it's more of a hand chew than a bite) on hands when he is being petted or excited. it just seems like it's a natural reaction for him. But i really really need to stop it, and like you, nothing seems to work. I'm going home for Christmas, and my sister has young kids, so i am very concerned he will bite one of her kids. Everytime I correct him, he just gets even more bitey !! arrgggh, soo frustrating
I'm glad teh bottle is working for you. Oscar just tried to drink the water.

Answer:
 Thanks for all of the tips.. We're on day 4 of peaceful and pleasant co-existence. Lucy is happy and so am I!
What worked? First "Yuck" immediately stopped the biting at the couch seams and pillows. Although now she doesn't want to get on the couch but on the chair...but at least she isn't chewing it. Or anything I put it on (if you put it on your hands don't put 'em in your own mouth)...
We stopped ANY and ALL forms of anything that might be viewed as playing rough. No gentle "tugging" (we never play tug of war with any of our dogs) for "drop it", no scruffing, we quit using the word "NO" (we now say uh-uh), and if she even looks like she wants to start getting bitey we walk away. Basically she plays ball/fetch, gets walks, and gets petted/massaged, but nothing physical in the way of play as far as her body is concerned.
If she gets bitey or rough we squirt (and not a mist) her with water with one short burst in the face. That immediately gets her off whatever she was doing (knawing/biting/etc). Then we move her attention elsewhere like her squeaky ball.
And I spray my sleeves, cuffs, wrists, and hands with bitter apple or yuck. She's left them alone as well. Today I sprayed nothing and haven't had a single nip.
She's back to the normal puppy mischief...kleenex out of the trash, dragging an occasional shoe down the hallway, etc. These are funny...and I'm happy dealing with them.
Thanks again everyone. :thumb4: